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JL. Yes.
RA. And doubting
myself. I would not have had the inspiration - I would merely have been
an echo or echoing someone else's thoughts.
JL. I understand that
in January 1971 you moved to Devon.
RA. Yes and the
property we purchased was surrounded by trees - beech trees.
JL. Do you think that
was a factor in the choice?
RA. It wasn't
conscious, I didn't think I WILL be painting trees from now until I die
- but the feeling of the trees, the trunks and their strength and
energy, was very very positive.
JL RA, could you say
something about "VIADUCT WOOD".
RA. VIADUCT WOOD; Watercolour 110 × 80 cm Private collection USA Photo Allan Grainger.
RA. I think the
whiteness is rather akin to what you were talking about earlier,
germination.
JL. Yes.
RA. The White is like
the White centre of a seed and it stimulates me when I am painting these
white shapes, its as if one is almost inside a seed pod, growing out
with it. Then as you come out, you are given one view across the
viaduct with the train on it. From there you pass into this Elysian
Depth of distance. On the right hand side you have Cornwall with its tin
mines.
JL. Why Cornwall?
RA. Well, I think the
centre section with the viaduct and train, one could say is the "within"
or belonging to the memory, the view through the railway carriage
window, the window frame joining part of the painting. On the right and
left is the "without" or now. I hope in "VIADUCT WOOD" that I have
given concept of space, like a Greek temple with its white pillars.
Also at the same time a sense of space, felt pictorially with its
distance and atmospheric perspective.
JL. What are you
trying to say to the viewer, to the person who looks at this picture?
RA. I think I am
asking them to come into it, to go on a journey, into the distance, to
travel through these layers and these magical places.
JL. Would you say it
was less a landscape and more a state of mind?
RA. It is less a
landscape in the accepted sense, like Constable's view of the "Hay Wain"
yes it is a state of the vibratory qualities, one against another.
JL. Is that your
house on the left?
RA. Yes.
JL. And when you were
doing this 1971 were you aware of your father's graining? The potential
influence?
RA. Yes.
JL. You were.
RA. I didn't get up
in the morning and say - "Oh yes my father was a grainer and I am going
to bring this in the work". I think it was the memory that he had taken
me through into a new world - through that paper bag.
JL. Yes.
RA. This was almost
like thanking him for taking me through that door, I was producing these
works which hopefully would be like a paper bag to the viewer, and they
would go into another cavern of jewels.
JL. What's
interesting - what has always struck me about these landscapes and we
used germinating earlier - is the tightly furled quality like beech
leaves wrapped in a bud.
RA. Yes.
JL. A sense of
nature, furled up, curled up. A microcosm within the macrocosm.
RA. Yes that's a good
observation particularly the energy of that trying to burst out.
JL. Yes - so that
takes us to "THE LIGHT OF THE WORLD" which is like a cosmic seed. When
did you paint that - is it contemporary with "VIADUCT WOOD"?
The Light of the World
RA. Yes - I would
probably work on that for three weeks then I would have to leave woods
and come back into the THE LIGHT OF THE WORLD.
JL. For refreshment?
RA. Yes.
JL. What are you
trying to express here then?
RA. More of an
abstract view of the tree - the growth energy and it's vibratory energy
when you touch a tree. The Christ within the tree, or person. It's a
picture of energy wave lengths. I would like to feel that if you shook
The Light of the World like you do a kaleidoscope - "THE LIGHT OF THE
WORLD" would transform itself into "VIADUCT WOOD". The centre was like
a spring and a pool to drink from, and then I could go back to another
wood.
JL. Yes. Is this
wood - I have to press the local influence - but you yourself have said
- "That is the Old Rectory" and Beech trees".
RA. And the Viaduct
is Holsworthy viaduct.
JL. Is this an
autobiographical picture, is it a visionary picture, is it a picture of
Putford or is it all there?
RA. It's all three.
JL. All three - yes I
thought it might be - yes. Now when was this done "Engineers Wood"?
Engineers Wood
RA. "EXPRESS WOOD" -
1973.
JL. A little later
but more or less contemporary.
RA. More or less.
JL. But more refined.
RA. Yes very much
more - rather than a 9th Symphony.
JL. More like Chamber
Music.
RA. Yes.
JL. Were you trying
to express in these more simplified forms - were you trying to express
anything essentially different, in "Engineers Wood", "VIADUCT WOOD" and
"ROCKING HORSE WOOD"?
RA. No. "Engineers
wood" might be a view you experienced when you get up first thing in the
morning. You look out through the window - and that was the first
impression of a vibratory subtle life of mist, much more peaceful. But
as the day unfolds, you get a deeper resonance coming through in
"VIADUCT WOOD". You are taking in more.
JL. Yes - I
understand. Why, judging by the number of reproductions with trains -
why trains?
RA. As a child I
enjoyed train spotting.
JL. But it doesn't
quite explain - you were eating bowls of cereals but you don't paint
those!
RA. No, perhaps
because I eat to live, not live to eat! We were of course living at the
time about half a mile from the main line to London - the LMS.
JL. So it was a very
strong impact.
RA. Yes - the energy
of the trains thundering through and the shunting going on everyday. So
these trains were impressed on my mind.
JL. What do they
impress on your mind - power?
RA. Yes.
JL. And removal to
distant places.
RA. Particularly the
distant places - yes. I remember one day, with pad in my hand, running
from one side of the station to the other calling to friends - 'a namer
coming through' - falling on some loose gravel and gashing my leg wide
open. The scar and the blood add a poignancy to the memory.
JL. But do you openly
- I mean do you put yourself into a nostalgic reverie - do you try to
draw on the past - and another question related to that - what is the
relationship of this recollection of your youth in relation to the
experience in Rye?
RA. The visionary
experience?
JL. Yes, what is the
relationship of those two? Do you consciously evoke your own past or
draw on your own past - because there is a strong autobiographical vein
here.
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